Posts by: Stephen Lea Sheppard

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[#][F] Stephen Lea Sheppard - 2/14/2013
Black Paper Moon wrote:
Stephenls wrote:
The norm isn't cavorting with animals; it's assuming your spirit shape and cavorting with people.

Thanks for the clarification. No comment on whether it'll be a big or small thing, in terms of presentation?

Not at this time.

(Really y'all are overestimating my involvement in these matters. John and Holden no doubt have their own plans.)

[#][F] Stephen Lea Sheppard - 2/14/2013
The Chills and One Last Joke wrote:
Why thank you Stephen, that is much less squicky.

Also more convenient in terms of having another parent handy to raise the kids.

[#][F] Stephen Lea Sheppard - 2/14/2013
Black Paper Moon wrote:
Stephenls wrote:
What do you think my position here will be?

The logic of your previous post says 'yes', but I thought I'd ask anyway. Given that, how much emphasis is going to be placed on beastmen when Lunars are presented?

While I find bestiality disgusting and would prefer not to see it in Exalted (for the same reason I would rather not see pictures of mutilated children), I don't have an issue if this is a thing that a few Lunars do, that most don't. Especially if the Lunars who do that are also presented as being feral and half-mad, like Ma-Ha-Suchi. I would be less happy if many (most) Lunars are going to be presented as sexually cavorting with animals. Because, you know, being the cannibalistic and animal-screwing Exalted is a little...

The norm isn't cavorting with animals; it's assuming your spirit shape and cavorting with people.

[#][F] Stephen Lea Sheppard - 2/14/2013
Black Paper Moon wrote:
Stephenls wrote:
Now, obviously, we are not doing this. But, yes, I think a big part of the appeal of cannibalism-only Lunars is it puts constraints on the characters you can play that you may not be entirely comfortable with.

So, um, what's going to happen with beastmen? Are Lunars in general still going to be depicted as doing bestiality, on top of cannibalism?


What do you think my position here will be?

[#][F] Stephen Lea Sheppard - 2/14/2013
Tiresias wrote:
Yeah, it'll help a lot if the Lunars in charge of the Lunar dominions are actually likeable.


Yes, competently benevolent rulers would make for a much more friendly and pleasant setting.

[#][F] Stephen Lea Sheppard - 2/14/2013
Tiresias wrote:
Yeah, it'll help a lot if the Lunars in charge of the Lunar dominions are actually likeable.


Yes, competently benevolent rulers would make for a much more friendly and pleasant setting.

(Meanwhile I am currently reading Seeing Like a State: How Certain Schemes to Improve the Human Condition Have Failed.)

[#][F] Stephen Lea Sheppard - 2/13/2013
ChrisARose wrote:
Only because the over done physicality of the Lunar Host has focused upon the Bloody Huntress and the Silver-Horned Watcher way the hell too much.

Here other aspects: Two-Faced Bride, the Walker at the Crossroads and the White Navigator
Those are the ones I proscribe to and the ones that are left out for being too civilized for the Barbarian Aesthetic showed down the splats throat.


We're not actually big fans of those five aspects. You'll note Glories: Luna doesn't talk them up much.

[#][F] Stephen Lea Sheppard - 2/13/2013
ChrisARose wrote:
Iozz-Sothoth wrote:
danelsan wrote:
ChrisARose wrote:
The Sun? He's always been a warrior - the Moon has always been a magician/sorcerer.

Artemis is a hunter, not a magician. Also, Japanese Pantheon.


Also, the Sun and the Moon spend a lot of time being chased by hungry hungry wolves in Norse myth. Not much time for either to be a magician or warrior there.



O my god Artemis: "Artemis of the wildland, Mistress of Animals"
A god of the Earth, a fricking Gaia God.





Hmm.

[#][F] Stephen Lea Sheppard - 2/13/2013
Segev wrote:
I can appreciate every aspect of this, except for the fact that it only works in a lunar-only vacuum.

Why would Solars and Sidereals be better at "stealing somebody's face" than the shapeshifters? And yet, we can't deny them the disguise powers, because disguise does need to be a thing that somebody OTHER than a Lunar can pull off.

The question for me, then, becomes, "How do we make Stealing Faces a bigger, scarier thing when a Lunar does it at that price than when a Solar puts on his divinely perfect makeup?"


This is actually the point that completely defeats all my arguments. The problem with cannibalistic face-stealing isn't all this "Oh, but then I can't play the character I want to play because I'll be faced with ethical quandries I don't like!" malarkey (no shit, that's the fucking point); the problem is it's impossible to implement without watching every other shapeshifter you ever do for the entire rest of the game line, because as soon as you give someone else the power to steal someone's face without murder, your murderous Lunar face-stealers are a Goddamn joke.

[#][F] Stephen Lea Sheppard - 2/13/2013
ChrisARose wrote:
Stephenls wrote:
ChrisARose wrote:
Face stealing is inane - even more when you kill people. Everything that face means - it dies with the person. You're not going to squat down in their life and keep what they *are* going. You'll wear it a couple days max, more likely an hour or two, and then never look at it again. I take the face of the King of Kalamazoo, sweet, so do I give up my life and become the King of Kalamazoo or do I move on and steal more faces? Once you stop living the life of King Kalamazoo - he is lost and dead - it is now a worthless mask. That title, that power, the station - all gone and dust when you take off the mask. Hell, your better off getting a buddy with disguise of the new face to run shit - at least he can do that (as they are not doing PC stuff) and can serve as a useful contact. Plus you can pop the spell and it gives you power over them. O - and you know - costs less experience, anyone can do it (as in not Lunar Only) - so on.

Lunar's should not need to do something so bloody and debase - they are *gods* - they are the Asura of the First Age. They should just be able to look at someone and done deal. Doppelganger is the way - killing - blehh like some tanner skinning someone and running around with their skin.

Taking a buncha skin-walker primitive Indians (and the worst elements of them at that) and slamming it into the super advanced - nuclear power wielding -gods of the Mahabharata. Just does not fit at all to me.


You have no imagination whatsoever. Two hundred years after King Kalamazoo is dust and no one remembers what he really looked like because all the official paintings and statuary are idealized, you still have his face. You can attach it to any identity you want. Now you can run two-man cons by yourself. Now you can assume his form and sit down on a bench and the people chasing you won't recognize you. You can waltz into a building where everyone is looking for your face by wearing his instead.

Think what you can do with five faces. A dozen?

How many will you steal?



Sounds like an awesome thing for a 200+ year old Lunar to be doing - stealing from morals and walking around with a dead dudes face. emotion-7.gif

It is pretty awesome, yeah.

[#][F] Stephen Lea Sheppard - 2/13/2013
Fanservice wrote:
Stephenls wrote:

Well, you could always play a Lunar who refrains from stealing faces, yeah.


For an awful lot of people that's the reason they want to play Lunar's in the first place. You're basically saying "Sure you can play this splat you really like, but now you HAVE to be a Cannibal if you want to play with the most appealing part of it"


Yes, that's exactly what I'm saying. You'll also have a hard time playing Vampire without playing a rapist.



Fanservice wrote:
And really I don't want to play a Cannibal every time sorry. If this means Lunars are"Not for me" then they're not for me, but I'd be sad for them to go from being my favorite splat to one I just know is going to fuck up the entire player party when their Cannibalism comes up and the party tears itself apart in moral outrage.


I really don't care about keeping the Lunars your favorite splat. Good thing I'm not in charge, eh?

[#][F] Stephen Lea Sheppard - 2/13/2013
ChrisARose wrote:
Face stealing is inane - even more when you kill people. Everything that face means - it dies with the person. You're not going to squat down in their life and keep what they *are* going. You'll wear it a couple days max, more likely an hour or two, and then never look at it again. I take the face of the King of Kalamazoo, sweet, so do I give up my life and become the King of Kalamazoo or do I move on and steal more faces? Once you stop living the life of King Kalamazoo - he is lost and dead - it is now a worthless mask. That title, that power, the station - all gone and dust when you take off the mask. Hell, your better off getting a buddy with disguise of the new face to run shit - at least he can do that (as they are not doing PC stuff) and can serve as a useful contact. Plus you can pop the spell and it gives you power over them. O - and you know - costs less experience, anyone can do it (as in not Lunar Only) - so on.

Lunar's should not need to do something so bloody and debase - they are *gods* - they are the Asura of the First Age. They should just be able to look at someone and done deal. Doppelganger is the way - killing - blehh like some tanner skinning someone and running around with their skin.

Taking a buncha skin-walker primitive Indians (and the worst elements of them at that) and slamming it into the super advanced - nuclear power wielding -gods of the Mahabharata. Just does not fit at all to me.


You have no imagination whatsoever. Two hundred years after King Kalamazoo is dust and no one remembers what he really looked like because all the official paintings and statuary are idealized, you still have his face. You can attach it to any identity you want. Now you can run two-man cons by yourself. Now you can assume his form and sit down on a bench and the people chasing you won't recognize you. You can waltz into a building where everyone is looking for your face by wearing his instead.

Think what you can do with five faces. A dozen?

How many will you steal?

[#][F] Stephen Lea Sheppard - 2/13/2013
Mizu005 wrote:
Apparently I could have saved myself some time double checking to confirm that Raksi's joints are a mutation and not a Tell for all the attention people payed emotion-4.gif


But, seriously, her wrists are not a Tell. Stop trying to figure out how they managed to shoehorn it in as a Tell, because they didn't!





I addressed that. I called the author who decided to make her 1e Tell into a Wyld mutation in 2e too clever by half and dismissed the decision as unworthy.

[#][F] Stephen Lea Sheppard - 2/13/2013
Fanservice wrote:
Stephenls wrote:

Now, obviously, we are not doing this. But, yes, I think a big part of the appeal of cannibalism-only Lunars is it puts constraints on the characters you can play that you may not be entirely comfortable with.


Conversely I think this is a big part of why they don't appeal to me. I don't really want to play a Cannibal every time I play a Lunar. It's a story which might be good once or twice and doesn't go away even if you have alternate methods but having to go through it for every single Lunar I make? Tedious.

Well, you could always play a Lunar who refrains from stealing faces, yeah. It's a thing! And almost anything you can accomplish by stealing faces you can accomplish through supernaturally-apt disguises, trickery and misdirection, charisma, and manipulation. Almost.

[#][F] Stephen Lea Sheppard - 2/13/2013
Krzyzewski Man wrote:
I absolutely agree with the idea that you should have powers that require a moral sacrifice. Lunar disguise is a strange place to be putting this, esp. since Changing Moon can effectively do this just for living. Lunars have Charms that allow them necromantic potency. The horror of crossing the line between life and death, I think, can be an interesting wage of power.


You can't disguise yourself as a dog and infiltrate through the kennels? You can't escape pursues by taking the form of a sparrow? You can't watch a conversation as a spider on the wall, or just use your amazing charisma to seduce a servant-boy and have him smuggle you in?

Fuck, put on some makeup. Wear an outfit that lets you cover your face. You can use dice-adders to apply your disguise, you know.

...or you could take someone's face. It'd be easy to do!