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[#][F] Holden - 9/7/2013
Fitter Happier wrote:
ugh, can we go back to the days where Holden made long posts about autochthonian society? plz? just until 3e drops?

*fondly reminisces about that autochthonian warfare thread*


I just re-read that damned thread. It mostly made me glad to be working on a new edition.

[#][F] Holden - 9/7/2013
Satchel wrote:
JMobius wrote:
The Invisible Voice wrote:
Sanctaphrax wrote:
The Invisible Voice wrote:
There are some spoilers I won't share because it will be AWESOME when you read them in print.


This doesn't actually work, you know. Spoilers don't reduce enjoyment.

This isn't a heavily-researched area, but the science that I've seen indicates that being told stuff in advance actually makes stories more fun. And my own experiences back that up.


It's story-like. It's not just things about mechanics or the game, it's that when you discover this stuff you'll scream, "That's so cool!" to the point where I might wish they hadn't said anything because I'll miss out. Sorry emotion-6.gif


FYI, this is going over about as well as telling starving people "but just THINK how tasty this food I could share will be later! I can't wait to see the looks on your faces when you finally receive vital nutrition". :P

Entertainment is not vital nutrition and I've run out of good humor for the week.

This is a bad comparison and the people to which it accurately applies are not people I want to associate with or even watch talk because apparently these people sustain themselves on knowing everything they're getting for their birthday.


Man, that would be the shittiest vampire ever.

[#][F] Holden - 9/7/2013
I'd probably drop the ki cost on TOA, and give TO a 1 ki / 1 health recovery effect in addition to the tag, instead.

[#][F] Holden - 9/7/2013
Capybara! wrote:
Holden wrote:
Consider that 300 year old geniuses in the setting routinely ponder questions like "what sort of architectural arrangement will allow me to channel earth-aspected Essence through the dragon lines in such a way as to cause earthquakes in my enemy's prefecture?"

At the upper level, Creation's architectural knowledge is probably equal to or better than what we have in the real world, and limited primarily by available materials. Architecture is something that the most wealthy and powerful individuals in the setting have always had huge motivation to invest in heavily, and still do. One of the Realm's five central holy figures is a builder.


I agree with all of that, but I'm thinking more in terms of aesthetic. On the one hand, a setting that incorporates too much iron age technology is going to start picking up anachronisms. On the other hand, Creation already has a ton of anachronisms plus an in-setting excuse for having them, plus why the fuck would you not want a Rome or a Constantinople in your setting.
...That settles that, then.

Gayo wrote:
Fuck you and your fake magic words!
This sentence makes me happy and I'm glad that you made it.


It helps that aesthetics are literally one of their architectural concerns.

[#][F] Holden - 9/7/2013
The Invisible Voice wrote:
I didn't steer the conversation toward spoilers, but there were a fair few. I mentioned some social stuff earlier. I didn't ask too much about Liminals, but I'm super stoked for them. I think the lemur quote was related to the social system, I'll try to remember the exact context. There are some spoilers I won't share because it will be AWESOME when you read them in print.


It was something to do with how we were writing animal rules with an eye toward Lunars, wasn't it? With Techniques and such?

[#][F] Holden - 9/6/2013
Capybara! wrote:
Edit: Actually, shit, should Creation have arcuated construction? I'm really torn about this.


Consider that 300 year old geniuses in the setting routinely ponder questions like "what sort of architectural arrangement will allow me to channel earth-aspected Essence through the dragon lines in such a way as to cause earthquakes in my enemy's prefecture?"

At the upper level, Creation's architectural knowledge is probably equal to or better than what we have in the real world, and limited primarily by available materials. Architecture is something that the most wealthy and powerful individuals in the setting have always had huge motivation to invest in heavily, and still do. One of the Realm's five central holy figures is a builder.

[#][F] Holden - 9/6/2013
Imrix wrote:
Holden wrote:
If you're defining "technology" as "stuff that can be done without active Essence manipulation"
I don't.


Cool, that's not the thread you're participating in, though.

[#][F] Holden - 9/6/2013
AnubisXy wrote:
MissMaddy wrote:
Thread non-sequitur... remember World War Z, the movie very unlike the book? In one scene the guy is trying to be quiet around zombies and he gets a phone call that wakes them all up.

While kinda silly, this practical concern was something that was actually pretty relevant when started parsing out the consequences of sending Infallible Messenger to spies and such. It's really not a great spell to use unless you have a dedicated 'telegraph operator' who doesn't mind having sprites pop up all the time to tell him things.

This also lead to the creation of another spell which was a kind of Sprite secretary, that would intercept the messenger sprites and make them wait quietly until the master was ready to see them.


If I remember correctly, I believe there was even a hearthstone in one of the books that functioned like that, allowing you to avoid getting the messages until you wanted to accept them.

As another aside, I did once use Infallible Messenger along those lines.

Our characters were being followed by a Night Caste Exalt who had tangled with our characters several times in the past. He was planning to kill us, but fortunately he had told us his name at one point. We finally tracked him down to a large restaurant and we knew he was somewhere inside. But, he was a master of disguise so it was impossible to tell who he was.

So my character cast Infallible Messenger and send him a message - when it would get to him it would start yelling really loud, "I'm right here! I'm the Solar! Look at me! Come and kill me!"

The ST shot me a dirty look, read the spell and sighed. "Wow. That's pretty freaking cheap."

So the little cherub flew over to the Day Caste and totally blew his cover.

AnubisXy


I think the cherub always whispers its message into the recipient's ear. Otherwise, though, valid use of the spell.

[#][F] Holden - 9/6/2013
AnubisXy wrote:
Isator Levi wrote:
I wonder if there are still going to be only Five Courts, or if it's simply going to reassess the standards by which they're organised and distinguished from one another beyond being vaguely built around each of the Virtues and Willpower (which probably would have been confusing considering that the raksha also had five broad philosophies that were built around the same, if only anybody had managed to remember any of them besides the Church of Balor).


It's very possible that we'll see some changes to Raksha social structure. Virtues are going away as a thing in 3rd edition, so having Raksha courts organized around virtues might not make much sense.

We might still have 5 major Raksha courts (and numerous lesser courts), but having the "Temperance" court of the "Compassion" court probably won't be the way Raksha organize themselves anymore.


AnubisXy


Also the old Raksha Courts were some of the dumbest, least-interesting things in the entire setting.

[#][F] Holden - 9/6/2013
Imrix wrote:
Holden wrote:
What does Autochthonia have that is straight-up more technologically advanced than Creation? Almost nothing. Their industrial base is almost entirely rooted in Autochthon's biology or is Essence-dependent,
... So? That's like saying the First Age wasn't more technologically advanced than Creation today because its technological base was so rooted in Solar dependancy. Autochthonians still have stuff like giant forcefields to protect outlying settylements. A lot of settlements in Creation would quite literally kill for that kind of thing.


If you're defining "technology" as "stuff that can be done without active Essence manipulation" then yeah, the First Age wasn't all that much more advanced than the best of what current Creation can do (the technological mean across Creation has dropped considerably). Its medicine was better, its glassmaking was better, but in large part Creation's development of purely mundane advances has been repeatedly stunted by its greatest geniuses getting up to point X, then jumping off into mystical fields of development. For a good example, see the weird state of naval technology, which is in some ways very sophisticated, but in others very primitive, because when the wealthiest and smartest folks in the setting get involved, they jump straight to things like "rather than distributing strain across multiple small masts, let's just make our one big mast out of invincible construction materials."

Giant force-fields are magical, not technological, and you're never going to see anything like that unless a) it's a Municipal Charm or b) for some reason Autochthon's body produced an Essence-shielded area, and some people came along, found a way inside, and built a town behind the shield. The things Autochthonia has that Creation would openly envy are three guaranteed square meals a day for everyone and free Essence lighting. Elevators, also pretty nifty.

[#][F] Holden - 9/6/2013
Crumplepunch wrote:
Mountain Folk are explicitly said to have mundane steam power and advanced clockwork devices (Scroll of Fallen Races, p23), distinct from their Essence technology and thaumaturgy. I assume Autochthonia is at least as advanced, given that they have the same mundane equipment.

The argument could be made that the relevant technology is part of Autchthon's subsystems and/or the Alchemical cities and is therefore Essence based, but that seems like splitting hairs in the definition of what is "mundane" for an Autochthonian.


My litmus is "continues being useful to you once you leave Autochthonia." Like, they have lots of steam-powered whatsits, sure, but they get that steam from tapping into Autochthon's systems-- drop them into the middle of the Scavenger Lands and they're not going to be able to build an Abney Park-level fictionalized steam engine.

Looking at the set of skills and technologies they can carry out with them or build from scratch outside the Realm of Brass and Shadow, then subtracting Essence-powered devices, you're left with a bunch of dudes wearing leather armor and carrying shortswords and crossbows. A lot of their advances compared to the norm in Creation are in very basic things (their metallurgy is very good, as is their glass-making). Their architecture and structural engineering are top-notch, but specialized to their environment; and Creation is also extremely advanced in those areas due to all the power to be reaped from geomantic architecture.

[#][F] Holden - 9/6/2013
Isator Levi wrote:
Sandact6 wrote:


A form of light communication is completely different from a wireless telegraph which does things instantly.


The heliograph is still a form of telegraph, and was probably what Grabowski meant when he said "Creation has the telegraph".


He was probably referring to Infallible Messenger.

[#][F] Holden - 9/5/2013
LordYushkuv wrote:
ok good points, any good weapons for the original capture?

as you need to pacify them without seriously injuring them.


Nets?

[#][F] Holden - 9/5/2013
Large, enclosed building with a roof? Not super challenging.

[#][F] Stephen Lea Sheppard - 9/5/2013
This should make Secret happy.