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[#][F] Plague of Hats - 2/4/2013
Third Edition uses the same Attribute and Ability spread as Second Edition.
Maryshelly wrote:
Will the new rules use the same format as the old game with the original WOD format, or will it move to a NWOD format of rules? I did read somewhere that the old system does not do the powerlevels of Exalted justice.

Not sure what this question is asking after. It's not as simple nWoD, it's not as complex as Exalted 2E.
Quote:
I have heard that the powerlevels will be lower but still "ridiculously awesome". Please elaborate, does that just apply to Solars or will everyone have a humbling?

That applies to everyone. Outrunning a horse or killing an army isn't a matter of a few Charms or just gaming a subsystem a little bit. If it takes you a single day to climb a mountain it's impressive rather than being chumpy because you obviously don't have movement-enhancing Charms.
Quote:
Someone mentioned that the new game will be much more fluid and not read like the VCR instructions of 2nd edition. Again, please elaborate.

Here's the opening passage on group social conflict from the Second Edition core:
Exalted Second Edition, p. 175 wrote:
While most social combat encounters pit individuals against one another, other occasions involve clashes of organized groups or individuals seeking to impose their will on such groups. As with the complementary units of mass combat, social units have the statistics of their leaders and several other traits that confer bonuses. Unlike military units, social units use all the traits of their leaders, including Essence, Virtues, Willpower and any other personal qualities. The reason for this is that the unit can be attacked as a unit only through social combat with its leader. Attacks on constituent members are also possible, but they must be resolved as normal social attacks against the characters in question rather than the unit.

Here's what might be the opening passage for the same kind of thing in Third Edition:
Quote:
Mercantile conquest and the toppling of nations is not done only through fleeting scenes of a hero’s sly bargaining or the slaying of an army. Sometimes the Exalted wield bureaucrats and treasuries as weapons to shape the world.

This is a system for resolving dramatic conflicts against, within and between organizations. These rules are for the desperate filing of a last-minute pardon, for one school of philosophers to discredit another or to establish a functioning trade network despite the saboteurs riddling the government. If there is nothing but busywork to do and no rivals to challenge, it’s safe to set this system aside.

[#][F] Plague of Hats - 2/4/2013
Third Edition uses the same Attribute and Ability spread as Second Edition.
Maryshelly wrote:
Will the new rules use the same format as the old game with the original WOD format, or will it move to a NWOD format of rules? I did read somewhere that the old system does not do the powerlevels of Exalted justice.

Not sure what this question is asking after. It's not as simple as nWoD, it's not as complex as Exalted 2E. It's not as complex as 1E either, sort of.
Quote:
I have heard that the powerlevels will be lower but still "ridiculously awesome". Please elaborate, does that just apply to Solars or will everyone have a humbling?

That applies to everyone. Outrunning a horse or killing an army isn't a matter of a few Charms or just gaming a subsystem a little bit. If it takes you a single day to climb a mountain it's impressive rather than being chumpy because you obviously don't have movement-enhancing Charms.
Quote:
Someone mentioned that the new game will be much more fluid and not read like the VCR instructions of 2nd edition. Again, please elaborate.

Here's the opening passage on group social conflict from the Second Edition core:
Exalted Second Edition, p. 175 wrote:
While most social combat encounters pit individuals against one another, other occasions involve clashes of organized groups or individuals seeking to impose their will on such groups. As with the complementary units of mass combat, social units have the statistics of their leaders and several other traits that confer bonuses. Unlike military units, social units use all the traits of their leaders, including Essence, Virtues, Willpower and any other personal qualities. The reason for this is that the unit can be attacked as a unit only through social combat with its leader. Attacks on constituent members are also possible, but they must be resolved as normal social attacks against the characters in question rather than the unit.

Here's what might be the opening passage for the same kind of thing in Third Edition:
Quote:
Mercantile conquest and the toppling of nations is not done only through fleeting scenes of a hero’s sly bargaining or the slaying of an army. Sometimes the Exalted wield bureaucrats and treasuries as weapons to shape the world.

This is a system for resolving dramatic conflicts against, within and between organizations. These rules are for the desperate filing of a last-minute pardon, for one school of philosophers to discredit another or to establish a functioning trade network despite the saboteurs riddling the government. If there is nothing but busywork to do and no rivals to challenge, it’s safe to set this system aside.

[#][F] Plague of Hats - 2/4/2013
Third Edition uses the same Attribute and Ability spread as Second Edition.
Maryshelly wrote:
Will the new rules use the same format as the old game with the original WOD format, or will it move to a NWOD format of rules? I did read somewhere that the old system does not do the powerlevels of Exalted justice.

Not sure what this question is asking after. It's not as simple as nWoD, it's not as complex as Exalted 2E. It's not as complex as 1E either, sort of.
Quote:
I have heard that the powerlevels will be lower but still "ridiculously awesome". Please elaborate, does that just apply to Solars or will everyone have a humbling?

That applies to everyone. Outrunning a horse or killing an army isn't a matter of a few Charms or just gaming a subsystem a little bit. If it takes you a single day to climb a mountain it's impressive rather than being chumpy because you obviously don't have movement-enhancing Charms.
Quote:
Someone mentioned that the new game will be much more fluid and not read like the VCR instructions of 2nd edition. Again, please elaborate.

Here's the opening passage on group social conflict from the Second Edition core:
Exalted Second Edition, p. 175 wrote:
While most social combat encounters pit individuals against one another, other occasions involve clashes of organized groups or individuals seeking to impose their will on such groups. As with the complementary units of mass combat, social units have the statistics of their leaders and several other traits that confer bonuses. Unlike military units, social units use all the traits of their leaders, including Essence, Virtues, Willpower and any other personal qualities. The reason for this is that the unit can be attacked as a unit only through social combat with its leader. Attacks on constituent members are also possible, but they must be resolved as normal social attacks against the characters in question rather than the unit.

Here's what might be the opening passage for the same kind of thing in Third Edition:
Quote:
Mercantile conquest and the toppling of nations are not done only through fleeting scenes of a hero’s sly bargaining or the slaying of an army. Sometimes the Exalted wield bureaucrats and treasuries as weapons to shape the world.

This is a system for resolving dramatic conflicts against, within and between organizations. These rules are for the desperate filing of a last-minute pardon, for one school of philosophers to discredit another or to establish a functioning trade network despite the saboteurs riddling the government. If there is nothing but busywork to do and no rivals to challenge, it’s safe to set this system aside.

[#][F] Holden - 2/4/2013
We're re-evaluating how to best deploy spoilers because the first two threads (especially the second) bogged down into a very small number of people holding the thread hostage for page after page after page.

[#][F] Holden - 2/4/2013
MrInsecure wrote:
Holden wrote:
Also, I've never really bean-counted with any of my characters, and never considered it fundamentally important.

Uh... I don't know if this is the case with anyone else, but the disparity created between well-optimized characters and non-optimized characters was the opening salvo that wound up driving away several of my players from the last two games I ran.


No, the fact that optimization was the difference between life and immediate, ignominious death or total uselessness was the thing that wound up driving away several of your players. If you don't correctly identify the problem, you cannot apply the correct solution, and will end up focusing on the wrong thing.

[#][F] Holden - 2/4/2013
Plague of Hats wrote:
The thing about 4chan and some other places is that they are distant and unregulated enough that the true wackos get to speak their minds. Like, actual conspiracy theory bullshit that is the equivalent of worrying about government mind control rays and UFOs, only it's about the inner-workings of a small group of gamers who get design and write the game they love.

I'll admit John's Facebook profile photo did look like an evil mastermind for a while, but he's never thrown me in a shark tank for telling him I didn't like one of his ideas.


Shark tanks are surprisingly expensive.

[#][F] John Mørke - 2/4/2013
Wise Old Guru wrote:
5. As the Dragonblooded Houses are apparently getting more of a Vampire-Style thematic focus...are there rules/guidelines for founding my own House?


No. That is a matter of storytelling including backstabbing, lying, thieving, murdering, fighting the Anathema and making lots of babies.

[#][F] John Mørke - 2/4/2013
Solar Exaltations explicitly only go to humans.

They also go to snakemen, Djala, and the like.

Do the math.

[#][F] Plague of Hats - 2/4/2013
The thing about 4chan and some other places is that they are distant and unregulated enough that the true wackos get to speak their minds. Like, actual conspiracy theory bullshit that is the equivalent of worrying about government mind control rays and UFOs, only it's about the inner-workings of a small group of gamers who get design and write the game they love.

I'll admit John's Facebook profile photo did look like an evil mastermind for a while, but he's never thrown me in a shark tank for telling him I didn't like one of his ideas.

[#][F] Plague of Hats - 2/4/2013
Revlid wrote:
Plague of Hats wrote:
This is pretty much the "Batman and Iron Man aren't Solars because they don't Flying-Is-A-Martial Art like Goku" argument all over again, man.
I'm not familiar with that argument. Could you explain the similarities?

"These comic book characters are defined in their works as 'just' exceptional humans, therefore they would be regular mortals if translated into Exalted."

"These mythological characters are not defined by specific terms of the Lunar Exalted, therefore they would be something else if translated into Exalted."

[#][F] Holden - 2/4/2013
Ferrinus wrote:
Holden wrote:
Because I value ability to customize more than paper-equivalence; because I don't want to mug you for XP because you knocked over a Guild caravan and stole some money and an artifact, or made a friend; because if we can't have actual equivalence, I'd rather have custom-crafted advancement that evokes a deliberate feel; because I like the ability to emphasize certain options at chargen vs certain options during play; and because I think paper-equivalence is fake equivalence and doesn't solve the actual problems that character disparity causes at tables (or, often, even address the causes of it).

Also, I've never really bean-counted with any of my characters, and never considered it fundamentally important.


Aren't you instead mugging me for XP if I make a friend during chargen? Or, indeed, if I fail to take the options you chose to emphasize at the time you chose to emphasize them?


No, I am mugging you for bonus points, if you want to say "I have extensive contacts in the Guild" and have that just be a thing.

If you go out and make contacts during play, hey, congrats, enjoy your contacts.

[#][F] Holden - 2/4/2013
Drascin wrote:
Holden wrote:
Asura wrote:
Holden wrote:
Ersatz wrote:

As a long time GW fan I feel I have to butt in here, and say that while they may be somewhat ruthless they are not malevolent as the internet likes to think. The edition changes, while regular, are not usually major and only the most extreme army builds would be need major purchases to bring up to date.
In my experiance, those players who do have very unusual army builds are typically power gamers who abuse rules loopholes and I have no sympathy for them or their wallet.


You gotta admit tho, the whole "note who our best vendors are and put them out of business" thing is pretty nasty. Brilliant, but nasty.


Cursed GW. The only things they talked in 4chan is Spess Mahreen and Whatever Dark gods that is in right now.

Nobody talked about 3rd Edition in 4chan!!
This makes me....grit my teeth.


Given 4chan, that is probably for the best.


What, you think /tg/ is all that much worse than this forum? It really isn't.


Nobody on this forum has called me a faggot any time recently, which is more than I can say for /tg/. So yeah.

[#][F] Holden - 2/4/2013
Sanctaphrax wrote:
Holden wrote:
Ferrinus wrote:
Holden wrote:
Shanwolf wrote:
3. Will Freebie points be making a return?


Yes.


1. Do freebie points raise traits at different rates than experience points do, such that it can be more "efficient" to use one over the other for a given trait?


Yep. Hell, there are some things (including lots of Merits) you can buy with freebies that you cannot buy with XP at all.


Wait, what?

Sorry if this oversteps the bounds of the thread and feel free to ignore it if it does, but why would you do that?

It seems like such an obvious bad idea that I feel like I must be missing something.

I mean, I thought you were trying to reduce the importance of bean-counting.


Because I value ability to customize more than paper-equivalence; because I don't want to mug you for XP because you knocked over a Guild caravan and stole some money and an artifact, or made a friend; because if we can't have actual equivalence, I'd rather have custom-crafted advancement that evokes a deliberate feel; because I like the ability to emphasize certain options at chargen vs certain options during play; and because I think paper-equivalence is fake equivalence and doesn't solve the actual problems that character disparity causes at tables (or, often, even address the causes of it).

Also, I've never really bean-counted with any of my characters, and never considered it fundamentally important.

[#][F] Chai Tea - 2/4/2013
Wise Old Guru wrote:
3. I'm excited about the "mythic" qualities of animals which are being emphasized here, because most human mythology roots in animals of one kind or another. I'm a little sad to see the scientific bits go, though...I really liked playing arthropod or deep-sea totems with strange and alien themes and powers. I've seen players get a lot of terrifying mileage out of spiders, wasps, sea urchins, centipedes, and in one absolutely horrifying case a tick-totemed Lunar. Dear Devs: please remember that some of us really really really love bugs, and that bugs are CRAZY AWESOME in terms of ideas for neat powers, even if you don't copy them exactly.
I love me some weird totems, too. I would not want to see them disappear either, and I don't think they will. That said, I think that in the places the Charms reference animals, they will reference things animals are famous for in human mythology and culture. (i.e., no Pistol Shrimp Ignites the Sun Atemi.)

[#][F] Holden - 2/4/2013
Hand-of-Omega wrote:
Holden wrote:
I should probably, for the benefit of the actual Lunar fans on the board, let you all know that the more people shove TAW in my face nonstop when we're trying to talk about 3e Lunars, the stronger the urge grows to deliberately erase any points of similarity between Lunars and TAW. .


This actually raises certain questions I've always had about how things work behind the scenes regarding the forum and development team. Are there ideas or concepts that the official creators have had, that they had to (or felt they had to) abandon because some fan homebrew on the forum got really popular? I'd hate to post something knowing that it could negatively effect the creative process for this game. Should we put disclaimers on homebrew, acknowledging that WW has the legal right to use any material therein without contest?

More to the point of the thread...can we please get some solid info on 3E Lunars yet? Hatewheel talks about them a lot, but it's usually in almost poetic terms, describing what he likes about them. Contrast this with Sidereals, who we already know have a new power, a new antagonist, and a different relation to the gods in heaven.

I'm not asking for hard spoilers or mechanics, or anything like that. Just some tidbits along the lines of what we've already been told about Siddies, if you please!emotion-2.gif

Dex,
wishing there was a "sad, begging puppy dog" Smiley...


The last time we saw some ideas on the forum we wanted to use that we hadn't already had ourselves at least fourteen months beforehand, we ended up hiring TDO. :p